Those ads on TV - enough is enough

[Neeek]

I realize that there have been a couple of threads on here about people’s rather nasty experiences of witnessing car accidents in recent days (and yes, they are frighteningly horrible), so I’m hoping that we can all distinguish the difference between those threads and this one, which I’ve deliberately started so as not to have other threads veer off-topic.

I’m going to have a rant about those bloody ads on TV. You know the ones I’m talking about – perhaps the “Enough is Enough” tagline is QLD specific, but you know them as well as the next person.

Having working in advertising and marketing my whole life, I am well aware of what makes an advertising campaign successful. When you’re dealing with a specific product, you can attribute sales of said product to the advertisement and therefore measure its success. Sell more widgets as a direct result of the TV advertising, and provided the target is reached, the campaign is a success.

Road safety is not a product, I realize this. I also appreciate that the campaigns we see are more “awareness campaigns” than anything else, thus they are difficult to measure in terms of their effectiveness. What I object to is the shock-tactics employed. These ads are graphic, they are disturbing and they make me wince. I don’t like watching them and frequently look away when they come on. As such, what purpose do they actually serve? They are there to remind me that if I speed, or if I drive whilst I’m tired or having an argument with a passenger or using my mobile ‘phone whilst driving, there exists the possibility of me causing an accident that will result in death, dismemberment, grief, pain and suffering.

Everyone, and I mean absolutely everyone, knows that when you’re not concentrating on the matter at hand (driving), you open yourself and others up to risk. This is common sense, and anyone who disagrees with me on this matter deserves never to slip behind the wheel ever again. Given that I, like 99.9% of the population in this country, don’t WANT to have an accident, I keep these things in mind when I’m driving and do my best to avoid the sorts of scenarios that the ads target. No amount of shock-tactic advertising is going to change that because it is simply common sense, and whether I’ve seen an advertising campaign showing babies getting orphaned because a driver wasn’t paying attention or not, I drive the same – to the best of my ability, all of the time, as alert as I can be. I don’t drive drunk, I don’t answer my ‘phone, if I’m knackered I won’t get behind the wheel. Common sense.

I don’t see the point in these ads. We know that accidents happen – they always will, and that’s never a good thing. We would all like to think that should we become involved in one, it’ll never be our fault and the other driver will be to blame. But sometimes it WILL be our fault, and there’s no excuse for that. My point here is that a shocking advertising campaign won’t make any difference whatsoever.

The whole campaign is a waste of space. It makes us feel guilty about driving. It scares us into thinking that the next time we take the car out, we’re going to die or kill others. It turns the car, which I believe to be one of man’s greatest achievements, into a rusty butcher’s knife in the hands of a deranged and paranoid nutcase. There’s no need for that.

I want it to stop, and when it does, I want to review the road toll and show the government that nothing has changed. The campaign is deeply flawed, doesn’t work and is therefore a waste of money. Let’s spend it on the health system so that when I rock up to A&E in the back of an ambulance after having had a near fatal collision in my car (which no awareness campaign could have avoided) I won’t get turned away because there are no doctors to treat me.

[csv8]

enough is enough, of hidding revenue cameras, behind trees, bus shelters, bottom of hills, etc. ENOUGH IS ENOUGH.

[GT-P BOSS]

I totally agree with you but the problem is allot of people on the road don't use commonsense people still drink and drive they still take drugs and speed on the roads and most of the time they have passengers or family onboard. I would also like these adds to go but these people need a strong message to get through their thick heads, how they do it I don't know but if it makes one person to think twice its worth it.

I also think its too easy to get a licence. :

[Peuty]

Originally Posted by GT-P BOSS

I totally agree with you but the problem is allot of people on the road don't use commonsense people still drink and drive they still take drugs and speed on the roads and most of the time they have passengers or family onboard. I would also like these adds to go but these people need a strong message to get through their thick heads, how they do it I don't know but if it makes one person to think twice its worth it.

I also think its too easy to get a licence. :

Yes, but one silly ad campaign isn't going to stop these deadheads from doing all those things you mentioned. Fact of the matter is, the road tolls haven't decreased a signifigant amount, so I am only going to assume that these ad campaigns are not working. As Neeek said, why doesn't the government spend its millions on something worthwile, like the health or social security systems?

[nobbystang]

Originally Posted by Peuty

Yes, but one silly ad campaign isn't going to stop these deadheads from doing all those things you mentioned. Fact of the matter is, the road tolls haven't decreased a signifigant amount, so I am only going to assume that these ad campaigns are not working. As Neeek said, why doesn't the government spend its millions on something worthwile, like the health or social security systems?

Not sure on the exact figures but hte TAC campaign was supposed to be successful in Victoria. These ads are just designed to make you think about what could happen when out driving. Alot of people drive around in their own world unaware of what consequences may arise from certain actions and hopefully these ads get through to them. I think if you had worked in advertising before you would be aware that this is a successful campaign. Yes millions of dollars would be better spent on health and in someway you could call this education, so i don't see it as a waste at all.

[Neeek]

Originally Posted by nobbystang

I think if you had worked in advertising before you would be aware that this is a successful campaign. Yes millions of dollars would be better spent on health and in someway you could call this education, so i don't see it as a waste at all.

I know this wasn't directed at me, but I *have* worked in advertising, and in my humble opinion the campaign is still a dud. I would consider myself to be your average driver and as such, it has no bearing on the way I drive whatsoever. Ergo, the campaign is a load of tosh. I would suggest that using scare tactics here is a complete waste of time.

[nobbystang]

Originally Posted by Neeek

I know this wasn't directed at me, but I *have* worked in advertising, and in my humble opinion the campaign is still a dud. I would consider myself to be your average driver and as such, it has no bearing on the way I drive whatsoever. Ergo, the campaign is a load of tosh. I would suggest that using scare tactics here is a complete waste of time.

Sorry, I meant to say that having worked in advertising i would assume you would need to know there is no such thing as common sense anymore and campaigns like this need to be directed to the lowest common denominator. The advertisers only have 30 seconds to portray a message and i feel they do it well.

I see this campaign as preemptive education. If it makes people think about their driving habits then it is successful. However, people are always going to believe they are above the norm and/or they will never be involved in an accident, like yourself, never say never.

I know like you there is no easy fix for this but to put it simply if you don't like the ad, change the channel. Many victims of road trauma and their families have tried in Victoria to have the ad pulled because it distresses them so much. They got the reply off the TAC we will happily send you a letter each week to advise on times our ads will be aired so you can avoid them but we wil not pull our ads as they are successful. This was not good enough for them and as such they went straight to ACA.

[WILDTRAKPX2]

These adds certainly have an effect on young kids. My 11yo son, who is a Ford fanantic and LOVES cars, said to me just the other day: "Dad, I don't want to get my licence any more". I asked why, and he said after seeing these adds, he is to frightened. This is coming from a young man who is generally not frightened of anything and I'm sure his attitude will change once he nears 17. The thing is, I really don't know if this a good thing or not...

[[Tonko]]

personally i dont think that these ads achieve a whole hell of alot people will still drink and drive, people will still speed...its a fact of life, also the licensing (?) system is flawed, we will always have high performance cars so instead of trying these scare tactics how about the governments try a different approach.....Education. what they are doing now is not trying to educate us but scaring us into fearing getting into your car to go to work, pick the kids up, etc... so we dont become one of their statistics..
but thats just IMO...

[4.9 EF Futura]

Originally Posted by Neeek

The whole campaign is a waste of space. It makes us feel guilty about driving. It scares us into thinking that the next time we take the car out, we’re going to die or kill others. It turns the car, which I believe to be one of man’s greatest achievements, into a rusty butcher’s knife in the hands of a deranged and paranoid nutcase. There’s no need for that.

I disagree with your overall opinion but am certainly able to understand your perspective.

It is perhaps worth considering that, based on your comments in the post, you are not a part of the target market. But - I believe - there are many many people who need this kind of graphic portayal thrown directly into their face. I congratulate you on your sensible approach to driving but unfortunately i think there is a number (a scary number) of people who do not share your "common sense" approach.

You would no doubt be aware that advertising is not the sole component of a marketing campaign. Advertising generates awareness - regardless of whether we are talking about a product or road safety message. It is the overall marketing campaign to which sales are attributed to - generating awareness is only a component of the overal strategy. In this instance - the government is purely trying to generate awareness - hence, a shocking ad campaign.

Surely the catch phrase "enough is enough" demonstrates quite clearly how frustrated the government is with the problem of people dying on our roads. The head honcho of the SA police said something along the lines of (around christmas time i believe) "We dont know what to do. We cant seem to stop people speeding on our roads and drink driving... we cant stop people dying on our roads.". They are running out of ideas.

In Melbourne i understand one can be booked for doing 2 or 3km/hr over the limit.... but people STILL continue to speed??? And then have the nerve to complain about revenue raising??? Here's a tip - dont speed, and it wont matter what bin/tree/obstacle the speed camera is sitting behind because you WONT GET DONE!!! Simple, no?

An add campaign like this reeks of desperation. I consider these graphic adds to be very extreme - but a severe problem requires an extreme solution. It would appear the severity of the campaign is not lost on you either neek.

I see a lot of things on tv that i dont like. Sitcoms, game shows, football - but find the easiest solution is to not watch them as opposed to demanding their removal. This certainly is a great topic tho and im sure there will be some strong discussion around the matter.

PS. I'd also like to add that the issues surrounding our public hospitals are much more complex than funding issues. All the money in the world will NOT sort out our shortage of doctors. To add the money spent on road safety awareness campaigns to the 55+ billion dollars currently spent on the system will do very very little.

[Neeek]

Originally Posted by 4.9 EF Futura

I disagree with your overall opinion but am certainly able to understand your perspective.

It is perhaps worth considering that, based on your comments in the post, you are not a part of the target market. But - I believe - there are many many people who need this kind of graphic portayal thrown directly into their face. I congratulate you on your sensible approach to driving but unfortunately i think there is a number (a scary number) of people who do not share your "common sense" approach.

You would no doubt be aware that advertising is not the sole component of a marketing campaign. Advertising generates awareness - regardless of whether we are talking about a product or road safety message. It is the overall marketing campaign to which sales are attributed to - generating awareness is only a component of the overal strategy. In this instance - the government is purely trying to generate awareness - hence, a shocking ad campaign.

Surely the catch phrase "enough is enough" demonstrates quite clearly how frustrated the government is with the problem of people dying on our roads. The head honcho of the SA police said something along the lines of (around christmas time i believe) "We dont know what to do. We cant seem to stop people speeding on our roads and drink driving... we cant stop people dying on our roads.". They are running out of ideas.

In Melbourne i understand one can be booked for doing 2 or 3km/hr over the limit.... but people STILL continue to speed??? And then have the nerve to complain about revenue raising??? Here's a tip - dont speed, and it wont matter what bin/tree/obstacle the speed camera is sitting behind because you WONT GET DONE!!! Simple, no?

An add campaign like this reeks of desperation. I consider these graphic adds to be very extreme - but a severe problem requires an extreme solution. It would appear the severity of the campaign is not lost on you either neek.

I see a lot of things on tv that i dont like. Sitcoms, game shows, football - but find the easiest solution is to not watch them as opposed to demanding their removal. This certainly is a great topic tho and im sure there will be some strong discussion around the matter.

PS. I'd also like to add that the issues surrounding our public hospitals are much more complex than funding issues. All the money in the world will NOT sort out our shortage of doctors. To add the money spent on road safety awareness campaigns to the 55+ billion dollars currently spent on the system will do very very little.

Excellent points all, and well made. The health system analogy was just one I thought of at the last minute - things are always more complex than you think, so you're right to pull me up on that.

Fact is, you cannot target this campaign to those that need it - bit like using a shotgun to shoot a mouse from 6 inches away when a pistol would do a better job. I completely agree that the whole campaign smacks of desperation on the part of the government. Perhaps if I was in their shoes, I might also consider what they've done as an option... but of course, I would never condone it.

The fact that these ads are part of a larger campaign is, sadly, lost on me. Here I am, sitting at home, and I see this ad. I know that billboards with cops and big radar guns line the highways. I see a couple of ads in the paper. But none of them have "enough is enough" on it... at least not that I remember. Therefore to me, the campaign is the ad - pure and simple. And that's one of the reasons I think it fails.

There is a minority group that needs to be affected by these ads, but $10 says it won't. Another failing point, if that rings true.

I appreciate that there's no easy solution to the problem, and I also appreciate that I don't have a better idea. The only one I've come up with so far is to impound cars where drivers act like idiots, but that's a whole problem in itself.

I'm rambling. Perhaps the problem is that there is no solution. It's always going to happen... I just don't need to be reminded of it. Some do... and if those people would like to cut their licences up and sell their cars, I'd be much happier.

[4.9 EF Futura]

Originally Posted by Neeek

Perhaps if I was in their shoes, I might also consider what they've done as an option... but of course, I would never condone it.

I guess that's the crux of it... im sure "the government" as an entity derives very little joy from producing these commercials and i doubt many individuals involved do either.

What they do remind me of is "driver intervention" i.e. when you are "let off the hook" for some sort of traffic offence and the magisrate has you attend a driver intervention session. Guaranteed component of these sessions are the graphic photos... so it almost seems like they are running a compulsory driver intervention program?

Look i'll be honest and come straight out and say i dont know enough about human behaviour, marketing, advertising or road safety to put any viable options up... I guess i just "see where they are coming from".... lol, here i am defending the government again...

Perhaps the problem is that there is no solution. It's always going to happen... I just don't need to be reminded of it. Some do... and if those people would like to cut their licences up and sell their cars, I'd be much happier.

You and I both mate

[[Tonko]]

Originally Posted by 4.9 EF Futura

In Melbourne i understand one can be booked for doing 2 or 3km/hr over the limit.... but people STILL continue to speed??? And then have the nerve to complain about revenue raising??? Here's a tip - dont speed, and it wont matter what bin/tree/obstacle the speed camera is sitting behind because you WONT GET DONE!!!

mate, its all of victoria... so you have NEVER been too busy watching the road conditions, traffic...etc to have crept over the speed limit? and considering the oz standard for all cars is +/- 10% i sure as hell would be ИИИИed to be getting half my license taken away for doing 64 in a 60 zone

wheels magazine do a to test most of their new cars by setting the cruise control too 100km/h and hit it with a speed camera, you would be surprised at some of the readings, some of these mean the difference between whether you keep your license or not (especially a double demerit weekend).
i think people that do say 25+ km over the speed limit deserve to get caught.. not the people doing 2km over.Heres a tip for you... wouldnt you be p issed if you lost 2 points for being 2km over?

[4.9 EF Futura]

Originally Posted by Tonko351

mate, its all of victoria... so you have NEVER been too busy watching the road conditions, traffic...etc to have crept over the speed limit? and considering the oz standard for all cars is +/- 10% i sure as hell would be ИИИИed to be getting half my license taken away for doing 64 in a 60 zone

wheels magazine do a to test most of their new cars by setting the cruise control too 100km/h and hit it with a speed camera, you would be surprised at some of the readings, some of these mean the difference between whether you keep your license or not (especially a double demerit weekend).
i think people that do say 25+ km over the speed limit deserve to get caught.. not the people doing 2km over.Heres a tip for you... wouldnt you be p issed if you lost 2 points for being 2km over?

Im aware of the flaws of a vehicle's speed indicator. I use a GPS device to relay cruising speeds and have tested many cars - all of which have been out (mine included - by up to 12-13 km/hr at highway speeds).

Every single one of them has been out and every single one of them has been conservative. Every single one of them has shown a higher speed on their instrumentation than has been detected by a GPS using its triangulation calcs. But i think its perfectly reasonable to assume there are cars which underestimate road speed.

In the true aussie spirit - you continue looking for other people or other things to blame?

Look - at the end of the day, when you get a licence you enter an agreement with the government to abide by certain rules. Including the speed limits. It's YOUR responsibility to ensure these rules are followed. Your responsibility - not the car manufacturer, not the government and their design rules - it's all up to YOU. If your speedo is out it's your responsibility to check it, to do something about it.

But it's always someone else's problem.... right?

[Keepleft]

[QUOTE=4.9 EF Futura] Surely the catch phrase "enough is enough" demonstrates quite clearly how frustrated the government is with the problem of people dying on our roads. The head honcho of the SA police said something along the lines of (around christmas time i believe) "We dont know what to do. We cant seem to stop people speeding on our roads and drink driving... we cant stop people dying on our roads.". They are running out of ideas.

FORGIVE ME, 4.9 Furura, and I do respect your view - but be very well assured, GOVERNMENT, both state and commonwealth are FAR from running out of ideas, YES I ACCEPT - that some police state so, my Germanic response is to get the hell out of the job pronto and hand it over to folk who *will* get it done properly. People, who "know-how" to improve things here, but are unable to do so just yet.

I am fed-up with certain IDIOTS employed in the service agencies, and of extreme left wing academic dopes, employed as consultants who are utterly devoid of human realities and of the legislative realities we as a nation operate.

Self serving, may of them.

I have told people here and elsewhere ONLINE that, the Commonwealth are very, very SOFT with what we mandate in our vehicle specifications. Far too much industry "negotiation" in the ADR process that effectively limits some of the better potential we could have. A "WHOLE-OF-TOPIC-response" is what will be needed in the future, stuff that is everyday requirement in more enlightened jurisdictions.

This covers penalties, allowances, behaviour and vehicle specifications and requirements, advertising - and I don't mean the politically correct rubbish we see out of the south.

The STATES can do much better. I know I certainly can if I had my way politically. NSW more than pulls its weight nationally and LEADS the rest of the country in our driver training demands and MATERIALS that we issue. I know because I effectively work with each jurisdiction. Credit where it is due.


In Melbourne i understand one can be booked for doing 2 or 3km/hr over the limit.... but people STILL continue to speed???

THIS IS A PROBLEM. The problem with Victoria, aside from utterly ignoring NATIONAL METROLOGY, is that the campaign effectively signals that 'the safe speed' is the speed limit! I call it "speed limit conditioning", it is downright stupid, dangerous and culpable that people are 'encouraged' to do so. We *must* set about the task of DIVORCING traffic, not MARRYING it. Marriage is HELL in this topic, be assured. We are NOT all the "SAME". Some just need additional help, that is all.

The only recognition that need be given is that the speed limit is the legal maximum speed, and that is that.

REMEMBER: 80% of crashes occur BELOW the posted and default speed limits. For this reason, amongst many, campaigns highlighting the 'goodness' of doing the speed limit are effectively doing great damage.

We assist this negligence by DELIBERATELY bunching up traffic through dangerously low speed limits, and IGNORING proper and proven NSW-like lane discipline driver training text applicable for freeways with three or more lanes, this results is WORSE on-road driver behaviour as people go about behaving like pigs. I see it every single day every single minute when on the road.

And so it goes. So, is speed a problem? YES every day I see people driving too fast as the 'potential' for trouble at point of operation is too great, this will have only 'referencing' relevance to the actual speed limit.


And then have the nerve to complain about revenue raising??? Here's a tip - dont speed,

I agree, EXCEPT that the speed has often ABSOLUTELY STUFF ALL about 'why' the people crash. Extremly simplistic, and such approach is failing us.


An add campaign like this reeks of desperation. I consider these graphic adds to be very extreme - but a severe problem requires an extreme solution. It would appear the severity of the campaign is not lost on you either neek.

Such ads and forums showing GRAPHIC video's only cause young women to run out crying. They DO NOT actually give advice, except to ram home the "the same old tired and faulty message", nor do the events teach them HOW to drive, OR even OFFER "PRACTICAL ADVICE" that they can actually apply. I know, because I make it a point to keep a close eye on such events here in NSW.

[4.9 EF Futura]

[QUOTE=Keepleft]

Originally Posted by 4.9 EF Futura

Surely the catch phrase "enough is enough" demonstrates quite clearly how frustrated the government is with the problem of people dying on our roads. The head honcho of the SA police said something along the lines of (around christmas time i believe) "We dont know what to do. We cant seem to stop people speeding on our roads and drink driving... we cant stop people dying on our roads.". They are running out of ideas.

FORGIVE ME, 4.9 Furura, and I do respect your view - but be very well assured, GOVERNMENT, both state and commonwealth are FAR from running out of ideas, YES I ACCEPT - that some police state so, my Germanic response is to get the hell out of the job pronto and hand it over to folk who *will* get it done properly. People, who "know-how" to improve things here, but are unable to do so just yet.

I am fed-up with certain IDIOTS employed in the service agencies, and of extreme left wing academic dopes, employed as consultants who are utterly devoid of human realities and of the legislative realities we as a nation operate.

Self serving, may of them.

I have told people here and elsewhere ONLINE that, the Commonwealth are very, very SOFT with what we mandate in our vehicle specifications. Far too much industry "negotiation" in the ADR process that effectively limits some of the better potential we could have. A "WHOLE-OF-TOPIC-response" is what will be needed in the future, stuff that is everyday requirement in more enlightened jurisdictions.

This covers penalties, allowances, behaviour and vehicle specifications and requirements, advertising - and I don't mean the politically correct rubbish we see out of the south.

The STATES can do much better. I know I certainly can if I had my way politically. NSW more than pulls its weight nationally and LEADS the rest of the country in our driver training demands and MATERIALS that we issue. I know because I effectively work with each jurisdiction. Credit where it is due.


In Melbourne i understand one can be booked for doing 2 or 3km/hr over the limit.... but people STILL continue to speed???

THIS IS A PROBLEM. The problem with Victoria, aside from utterly ignoring NATIONAL METROLOGY, is that the campaign effectively signals that 'the safe speed' is the speed limit! I call it "speed limit conditioning", it is downright stupid, dangerous and culpable that people are 'encouraged' to do so. We *must* set about the task of DIVORCING traffic, not MARRYING it. Marriage is HELL in this topic, be assured. We are NOT all the "SAME". Some just need additional help, that is all.

The only recognition that need be given is that the speed limit is the legal maximum speed, and that is that.

REMEMBER: 80% of crashes occur BELOW the posted and default speed limits. For this reason, amongst many, campaigns highlighting the 'goodness' of doing the speed limit are effectively doing great damage.

We assist this negligence by DELIBERATELY bunching up traffic through dangerously low speed limits, and IGNORING proper and proven NSW-like lane discipline driver training text applicable for freeways with three or more lanes, this results is WORSE on-road driver behaviour as people go about behaving like pigs. I see it every single day every single minute when on the road.

And so it goes. So, is speed a problem? YES every day I see people driving too fast as the 'potential' for trouble at point of operation is too great, this will have only 'referencing' relevance to the actual speed limit.


And then have the nerve to complain about revenue raising??? Here's a tip - dont speed,

I agree, EXCEPT that the speed has often ABSOLUTELY STUFF ALL about 'why' the people crash. Extremly simplistic, and such approach is failing us.


An add campaign like this reeks of desperation. I consider these graphic adds to be very extreme - but a severe problem requires an extreme solution. It would appear the severity of the campaign is not lost on you either neek.

Such ads and forums showing GRAPHIC video's only cause young women to run out crying. They DO NOT actually give advice, except to ram home the "the same old tired and faulty message", nor do the events teach them HOW to drive, OR even OFFER "PRACTICAL ADVICE" that they can actually apply. I know, because I make it a point to keep a close eye on such events here in NSW.

Keepleft - there is no reason to ask for forgiveness if you wish to dissect my post. I have spoken to you both on the forums and via PMs and you know i have a great deal of respect for your opinions/views.

I thoroughly enjoyed reading your post despite the fact it dissmisses many of my beliefs - i guess my only defense is that i am "defending" the advertising campaign and not the government's approach to reducing the road toll. Nor am i claiming the speed limit to be the "safe" speed.... i just believe that the limit is the line that's been drawn in the sand and if you get done in breach of this limit, you should accept responsibility for doing so....

A victim of the government's simplistic approach.... yes I am. But this is the mouth that feeds.... I see little/no genuinely independent information on the topic... apart from groups like the pedestrian council but their bias is clear and their independence questionable....

[Redrum]

I believe the ads just desensitise the whole issue and unless one becomes involved in a fatal or in fact any accident they do not pay much attention to them.

I also believe some of the target audience could not give two hoots about the ads or the laws, they will just keep re offending........

The vast majority of driver's I have come across seem to lack a general road awareness. They are so stuck in their own worlds they are tunnel visioned and appear oblvious to what is going on around them. I think all drivers should complete a comprehensive defensive driving package. Not just on how to avoid an accident, but how to watch everything that is going on around you and not just the car in front. This would be money better spent than these ads.

[The Monty]

I disregard all adds on TV. Too much thinking while driving, and not concentrating on actually driving, is what will end up making me crash. If I was driving and thinking, "was I doing 1 K over then? Was I doing this, did I just do that, should I have done that etc etc," I would have crashed my car a lot sooner than now. When I drive, I think about the road, whats ahead, whatsbehind, and what my car is doing. Thats all. Good example, the other day I done a wonderful drive through Mt. Neebo, Mt Glorious and Wivenhoe dam. Up through the mountains, I stuck to the speed limit (60, 70 and 80) even thoughthe speed I was doing through some parts while being on the speed limit, were what some would call dangerous. I know that they were dangerous, but I think its better to know the limits of your car and driving skills , then to not know it, and get into a situation I thought me or my car would handle, and not knowing what to do if I lost control. I learnt a lot about Brake fade in that trip, which I didnt know much about before the drive. I probably should have stopped at the first sign of it, but I wanted to know what my car does when it has brake fade, how it handles differently, and what I have to do to change my driving style to suit it. Anyway, I got to the bottom of Mt. Glorious (the western side) on to the highway back to Ipswich and I couldnt see my wallet. I had a mind lapse. I took my mind completely off driving, reached over and had a look and feel if it was under the passenger seat. Look up and I see Im about to drop off into that blue crush dust gravel stuff. By the time I reacted, the back tyre had got into it, I swung the car out to get back on the road a little to hard, and the back end swung out. If I had not put myself in this in a more controlled area, and made my car do this so I coudld learn how to react in that situation, when I first felt the bumb slide, I would have reefed back the other way, and tha would have caused me too spin, and I would have been over the enbankment. But I had already taught myself how to react in this situation, let the bumb come out, let the steering wheel slide back to straight position and Walla. The car straightens itself out. Anyway my points here are, if you are thinking about things like that add campaign and all the other driver campaigns they are pushing to us, while driving, and not keeping your mind on the job at hand (actually driving), you are at more risk of crashing. This was demonstrated by my experience of looking for my wallet, and the second point is driver training (either on your own behalf, or through a school[obviosly the better option]) should be done by everyone, as you will learn how to control situations you are likely too come across while driving, that you may not know how to control, and could simply be deadly. So thumbs down from me towards the adds, and a thumbs up for education, and driver training.

PS: Probably my longest post here, and I lost myself halfway through, so I got a little O/T. Sorry.

[Tiapan]

The problem is that everyone think when you turn 17 its their right to have a license... the driving tests are way too easy and they should go for at least 2 hour, or in phases like city,wet,contry and highway, any one can learn their local street and drive to perfection.
try making the learners drive in unfamillar terrotory and see what the confusion causes,

seems like alot of hard work but would save MANY lives and stop many small crashes.

also i agree these ads make drivers more nervous and edgy and driving without confidence is the easyiest way to crash...i believe

[ltd]

Problems lay where the respective governments; predominantly state governments as they are finaincially responsible for the roads, as they continue to shirk their responsibilities for the roads, law enforcement and visible policing.

I witnessed an idiot at around 3am Friday morning on Wallgrove Rd near the M4 speeding in a van. As he came to the right/left near the M7 office entrance, he lost it, took out a keep left sign on the median strip and then hit the barrier. He then proceeded to do a U turn (as he was facing the wrong way) and drove off with his right rear wheel jammed in the guard and facing outward 90 degrees to where the other three wheels were pointing.
After about 1km of a screeching smoking and eventually exploding tyre he lost it again and almost collided head on with an oncoming vehicle. Shortly after that he noticed the shower of sparks emanating from the rear of his vehicle and pulled over. Not wishing to approach this lunatic I called the police who turned up about an hour later after this drunken man had walked off.

After giving a statement the police informed me that after confronting the bruised and bleeding owner who was still affected by a "substance", he reported the vehicle as stolen, and he lived only a few blocks from where the vehicle came to rest. They then informed me that they're sure it was him, as he has 3 other DUI's and a twice cancelled licence to his name, but as they didn't witness it or witness him leaving the van there was nothing they could do.

This is where the problem lies in our roads, people are committing crimes with a sense of impunity. Serial offenders know that crossing to the wrong side of the road calls off a police chase. They also know that denying they got the letter from the RTA stating their licence is suspended allows them to plead ignorance. They also know that fleeing the scene of an accident gives the police no power to arrest unless they themselves witness it.

This guy almost caused a massive head on accident whilst driving a 3 wheeled vehicle and whilst drunk or high, and still has his licence. I wonder how long before he does it again? Had this useless bastard been arrested, charged and locked up for DUI, driving whilst suspended, neg driving, driving a dangerous unroadworthy vehicle as well as fleeing the scene of an accident and not to mention almost killing those occupants of the oncoming vehicle then maybe the road toll would be less.

Simply, serial offenders need to go to jail. Introduce sentences for offences like these and prosecute the crap out of people who have no regard for their fellow man. My opinion is High range drink driving and very serious road offences should be a mandatory jail sentence. Watch how quick the DUI rate falls then. You could use this approach on other offences like speeding 45k over the limit - 6 months jail. Drive unlicenced - 1 year prison. Manslaughter whilst under the influence - 5 years minimum.

[flappist]

Originally Posted by ltd

Simply, serial offenders need to go to jail. Introduce sentences for offences like these and prosecute the crap out of people who have no regard for their fellow man. My opinion is High range drink driving and very serious road offences should be a mandatory jail sentence. Watch how quick the DUI rate falls then. You could use this approach on other offences like speeding 45k over the limit - 6 months jail. Drive unlicenced - 1 year prison. Manslaughter whilst under the influence - 5 years minimum.

Theoreticly a good idea but if the penalty is too high then the results will be disasterous.

The reason why the death penalty was dropped for rape in the USA was that all the rape victims were murdered because there was no reason not to.

Every situation is different.

Hypothetical:

You are drunk and you friend is bitten by a Tiapan. You are out of phone range and if you do not get them to hospital they will die. You have no licence.
On the way in you are stopped by a random breath test and the coppers then transport your mate to hospital and he lives but as you are unlicenced and drunk and now there is a MANDATORY jail sentence, you get a holiday....

Or even something less uncommon. You are a loser ИИИИhead unlicenced in an unregistered car (like one of those caught every weekend here). You are full as a goog and out of smokes and the servo is just down the road and you'll be right.
Drunk people always make sensible & concidered decissions don't they.
Oh no, disco lights.
Now you will face 5 years so you panic and do a runner and lose it at 150km/h in a 50 zone straight into a group of kids playing in a park.
You are in lots of trouble now but you are not dead or maimed like the kids......

Yes I know everyone can come up with some way out never happen hypothetical but the world is not a black and white place, there is a lot of grey.

Some people will continue to be stupid regardless of what happens. Nothing can be done about it. Sad really......

If you really think that gestapo tactics work then look at your own profession. Penalty for drink flapping, game over, no-refund. How many hung over pimply faced instructors do you know who have given early morning lessons but were not game to drive in case they got rolled? I remember quite a few. And you know what FOIs & the catchems are like....

[FAT071]

Enough is Enough!!

I'm sick and tired of the cops hasseling the true enthusiast and picking on them as if their hoons, we are not all HOONS, a little skid here and there is nothing compared to the racing/burnouting up and down local streets and Hi-ways at all hours of the day/night, there is a time and place for it and its not on our local streets.

These HOONS laugh at the law and think that its a joke, till their mate or an innocent bystander gets killed.

Enough is Enough, we will not stand for it any longer.

Its time to stand up and say to all the HOONS out there, Enough is Enough and if you keep this crap up there will be NO car scene left in Australia for any of us to enjoy with our kids.

Thats my point of veiw on Enough is Enough.
Mick
(this will open a can of worms)

[Smoked]

1. being caught speeding doing 4 or 5 km/h at the bottom of the hill is robbery, it is not dangerous driving.

2. There are more people on the road now than there was 10 years ago yet our death toll is less, Crunching the numbers that spells out to me an improvment in road safety despite the stupid ads.

[ltd]

Flappist, I agree it may be a little extreme and there are definately mitigating circumstances like the taipan, however at the current rate people are not as concerned about the consequences as we were years ago. It beggars belief that we have an ever increasing rate of unlicensed and ergo uninsured drivers who recklessly endanger the lives of everybody due to their own selfishness. Quite frankly, I believe if you have such scant regard for others then you don't really deserve to live in society. You move from being a human to an oxygen thief. Of the recent accident in Sydney's west on Sunday, my heart goes out to the poor innocent victims due to someone elses stupidity.

It could be you, I or anyone else minding our own business when some immature little hothead makes a miscalculation and changes our lives forever. The fools who continually perpetrate such madness on our roads need to be removed from their comfort zone and sent somewhere to ponder just what their actions have resulted in. Frankly, that mad idiot who drove that van on Friday morning and almost hit the oncoming car does not deserve to live in our society. Whilst mistakes may happen this jerk continued on his way even after he almost ended his own life. Situations like that make all rational people stop and take a reality check but the utter selfishness displayed here showed here is a total lack of empathy for others; the very definition of Evil.