Ohhh No !! I Bought Another Wheels Mag!!! - Page 2

ClevlndStemer · 24-10-2007, 03:10 PM

But which Falcon did deserve COTY? I don't even think BA really deserved it.
I don't think commodore did either, but then only the VT won it recently? When before?

5.4 GT · 24-10-2007, 03:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ClevlndStemer

But which Falcon did deserve COTY? I don't even think BA really deserved it.
I don't think commodore did either, but then only the VT won it recently? When before?

I think BA DID deserve it. In 02 Ford introduced the Turbo 6 (a highly acclaimed engine) to the Australian family car. Was also ahead of Holden in offering a Tiptronic transmission. It was also a much better drive and package compared with the Holdens (superior ride and suspension). It was one of the most clever repackages of a car ever after the AU disaster. The BA turned the Falcon right around and put it back on track again.

People are making the VE/WM out to be a quantum leap in motoring (most of these people have not driven a car that was made in the last 10 years!!). I can tell you from first hand experience it's not all it's cracked up to be (WM vs BF). It's just Holden's marketing machine gone wild (well done to them because Ford can't market for cr**).

FordFella · 24-10-2007, 04:13 PM

I must say, Wheels have gone rather shite lately. Pre-Ve, I wouldn't say that they were Holden fanatics, but for some reason post-Ve they seem to have gone absolutely nuts. I wonder which tool was responsible for this (I don't think it was Carey, Robbo or Bulmer, probably some loser like Newton or Hawley). How do I know so much about the writers - Because I have a subscription that I am not renewing!

Blonk · 24-10-2007, 04:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GTP owner

Driver difference. The Ba series2 f6s were all expected to wallop everything at our drive day - twas funny when a series 1 manual gt-p was the quickest!

Maybe some of those F6 drivers have not long purchased it and are probably still re-learning to drive a turbo charged car and not just a big displacement, I would say if a GTP was faster there were a lot of lousy drivers around or the GT was on slicks, because as I said, the only ones I have seen that can boogie have a S/C strapped on to it.

I get embarresed for GT drivers that line up next to VE 8's and F6's..

Unfortunate but true. Hopefully with the orion will come the 330kw promised and might put them back in the game, but I believe the F6 will be entitled to the crown second model in a row..... Just my opinion and I may be wrong.

T3ts50 · 24-10-2007, 04:35 PM

They tend to favour the 'newer' car. Because VE is relatively new on the block, they tend to favour it. It was the same when the BA was released at the same time as VY, because it was new. VY was just a reskin of the VX and nothing new mechanically. Orion will probably get the same treatment next year.

ClevlndStemer · 24-10-2007, 04:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaveO_SP

I think BA DID deserve it. In 02 Ford introduced the Turbo 6 (a highly acclaimed engine) to the Australian family car. Was also ahead of Holden in offering a Tiptronic transmission. It was also a much better drive and package compared with the Holdens (superior ride and suspension). It was one of the most clever repackages of a car ever after the AU disaster. The BA turned the Falcon right around and put it back on track again.

People are making the VE/WM out to be a quantum leap in motoring (most of these people have not driven a car that was made in the last 10 years!!). I can tell you from first hand experience it's not all it's cracked up to be (WM vs BF). It's just Holden's marketing machine gone wild (well done to them because Ford can't market for cr**).

Compared to Holden it was a much better car but I still don't think it deserved the COTY. The car was and is still not (after 4 updates) up to scratch compared to many other cars available.
However the release of the VE has in many ways shown the age of the B series platform.

BionicGT · 24-10-2007, 04:43 PM

[QUOTE=Blonk]Simple choice really unless your into the sound they make when the take off...QUOTE]
That's at the top of my list !

:

FordFella · 24-10-2007, 04:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by T3ts50

They tend to favour the 'newer' car. Because VE is relatively new on the block, they tend to favour it. It was the same when the BA was released at the same time as VY, because it was new. VY was just a reskin of the VX and nothing new mechanically. Orion will probably get the same treatment next year.

I too wouldn't accuse Wheels of continuous bias - but this coverage of VE is crazy. I think is because they're are savouring Holden's best large car status before Orion, then comes another 4 years of (boring) Ford domination. If you look throughout the years with Wheels, Ford has almost constantly been in front, all the way back to the EA (with the exception of live-axled base model AU's - but the double-wishbone(?) ones smashed the VTs.) Ironically when Ford wasn't the better of the two brands the Falcon sold better - so if Orion isn't better than VE in Wheels' eyes then see it as a sign of hope!

GTP owner · 24-10-2007, 04:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blonk

Maybe some of those F6 drivers have not long purchased it and are probably still re-learning to drive a turbo charged car and not just a big displacement, I would say if a GTP was faster there were a lot of lousy drivers around or the GT was on slicks, because as I said, the only ones I have seen that can boogie have a S/C strapped on to it.

I get embarresed for GT drivers that line up next to VE 8's and F6's..

Unfortunate but true. Hopefully with the orion will come the 330kw promised and might put them back in the game, but I believe the F6 will be entitled to the crown second model in a row..... Just my opinion and I may be wrong.

No it was not on slicks and it was stock as a rock. A few of the gts were modified too. The main arena a gt will lose is in a straight line fight.
Out in the real world, with a few corners, some big differences in driver ability, and how easy the car is to drive quickly will have a large impact. Motor and wheels tend to look at the hundredths of a second difference in this speed or that, rather than how easy the vehicle is to use by an average driver. Remember, average means half are worse, and half are better - of course we are always better drivers than average aren't we?

BionicGT · 24-10-2007, 05:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FordFella

I too wouldn't accuse Wheels of continuous bias - but this coverage of VE is crazy. I think is because they're are savouring Holden's best large car status before Orion, then comes another 4 years of (boring) Ford domination. If you look throughout the years with Wheels, Ford has almost constantly been in front, all the way back to the EA (with the exception of live-axled base model AU's - but the double-wishbone(?) ones smashed the VTs.) Ironically when Ford wasn't the better of the two brands the Falcon sold better - so if Orion isn't better than VE in Wheels' eyes then see it as a sign of hope!

I agree the bias seemed to have started with the VE. Seems they were sucked in by Holden's marketing campaign. Ever time they compare a Calais to a BMW on their TV ad I think of the VE/WM Holdens I've driven where quality has been lacking and bits keep falling off the interior or components failing.

Note that in 2004, the Ford Territory won Wheels COTY award - which was well deserved.

XR6_190 · 24-10-2007, 06:13 PM

Yeah they are a bit biased for the VE, that said they were for the VT as well, what makes it stand out is comparing a brand spanking new model to a 5 year old design, ie:- VE to BF and VT to EL, when the Orion finally comes out it will probably put Ford back into equal favour, just like AU would have if looked more conservative.
That all said, Wheels were quite taken by Mondeo, so maybe they aren't as biased as you would think.

No I don't work for Wheels

GT 4eva · 24-10-2007, 08:34 PM

yeh its funny that WHEELS, MOTOR etc rave about the VE and compairing it to a 5series please!!!!WTF only a fool would beleive that. its funny my bother-in-law and mate are massive holden fans and DISLIKE fords but they BAG the out of the VE they rekon daewoo must be building them aswell ie poor finish and shithouse looking only the HSV are anygood they rekon.
on the CAPTIVA is it a rebaged daewoo or not? like the epica

FORD3V · 24-10-2007, 11:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ClevlndStemer

Well if you want to read about modded cars then you shouldn't be looking at Wheels and Motor at all, you should be reading street machine, peformance ford, etc.

I dont look at or read either of them,havnt for around 3 years.

Pedro · 25-10-2007, 07:10 AM

I don't buy Wheels or Motor, but I read them .... for five or so minutes at the news agent. Just flick through and read the interesting articles (if there are any) which genearlly takes about five minutes. They should rename them ... one could be "Holden" and the other "Commodore".

Xitdxr · 25-10-2007, 08:10 AM

I see some attacks have been made on MOTOR. I dont know why that is, they always seem to be informed and give a fairly unbiased review. Wheels on the other hand swing to what is newer at the time, and figure that cause its new its better. As for the claim that a calais is better than a 5 series, i laugh everytime i see that add, having driven the 5 series time an time again i will tell you now, no Holden or Falcon is as polished. The only thing i can think of in the 5 series that i dont like is the dash, and thats only because of its design.

ADSXR8 · 25-10-2007, 08:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaveO_SP

The quick F6's were only in BF ZF form (haven't heard of any stock BaMkII's crack any good numbers). Unless your BaMkII is modded I wouldn't comment?

Infact in the February 05 edition of Motor (the mag that always gets better performance times) the BaMkII F6 Typhoon in excellent conditions only got a 6.40 0-100 and 14.64 0-400 (the Clubby in the test got a 5.83 0-100 and 14.01 0-400).

Only a few months ago Motor or wheels tested manual GTS307 and manual BF Typhoon. Both punched out mid 5's and high 13's. GTS stopping the clock quicker and Typhoon have a larger terminal speed. And in gear acceleration the Typhoon creamed it!

Its been argued many time before, but I have owned both, BA GTP and now BF Typhoon, and however sounding the worse, the Typhoon is miles quicker.

ADSXR8 · 25-10-2007, 08:26 AM

Perhaps somebody with more time than me could search for the thread.

ClevlndStemer · 25-10-2007, 09:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FORD3V

I dont look at or read either of them,havnt for around 3 years.

So what was the point of your original post? I mean you bagged out Motor and Wheels saying you only like to read about modded cars, then a selection of mags relating to modded cars was listed and then you state you haven't read them either in a long time. Sooo you simply came here to increase your post count.

V3RSAC3 · 25-10-2007, 10:02 AM

edit - mistaken

Blonk · 25-10-2007, 11:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GTP owner

No it was not on slicks and it was stock as a rock. A few of the gts were modified too. The main arena a gt will lose is in a straight line fight.
Out in the real world, with a few corners, some big differences in driver ability, and how easy the car is to drive quickly will have a large impact. Motor and wheels tend to look at the hundredths of a second difference in this speed or that, rather than how easy the vehicle is to use by an average driver. Remember, average means half are worse, and half are better - of course we are always better drivers than average aren't we?

Yep, were all average drivers and thats why we spend 60k on a car that WUPS a V8's ***........

My personal choise was the F6 over the GT because it was the much better car all round hen...... I wish ther old men with there GT could just GTFO.......
ce the performance car of they year.......... Bet the orion F6 gets it too and the GT will be below the XR6T's.........
Your dreaming if you think a shop boss is better than a shop I6T, and your dreaming if you thing a Boss 8 is better than the new VE 6.0 L..

Get it!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Your dreaming, like the magazine says...

Denial doesnt make a car quicker!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

FORD3V · 25-10-2007, 11:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ClevlndStemer

So what was the point of your original post? I mean you bagged out Motor and Wheels saying you only like to read about modded cars, then a selection of mags relating to modded cars was listed and then you state you haven't read them either in a long time. Sooo you simply came here to increase your post count.

The point of my original post was to express my opinion on wheels and motor mags,the same as everyone else in this thread.

I didnt see or read a list about modded car magazines??? You named two magazines.

When I said I havnt read either in a long time I was refering to wheels and motor mags.

I dont recall saying that I havnt read modded car magazines in years???

I never listed or stated the names of any magazines relating to modded cars,I merely said I would rather read about modded cars,I never stated where I would be reading this material,maybe on a forum such as this one.

If you want to listen to the opinions of people who jump in a car for 5 minutes and then tell whether you should buy it or not,that is entirely up to you,I for one dont care what they think.

Blonk · 25-10-2007, 11:16 AM

OK.. straight forward opinion of the boss motor

I bought an F6 and haven't regretted a minute of it

\

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gtfpv · 25-10-2007, 11:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blonk

OK.. straight forward opinion of the boss motor

I bought an F6 and haven't regretted a minute of it

\

:

chill dude , i can see by the tone in your posts , that you are not sure you bought the right fpv. it's horses for courses. ya never gunna have the looks . the style , the sound or the reputation. or the grunt.
you will however have the faster car. all GT owners have come to accept that.
this is about mags being holden bias.
i for one believe the typhoon . is faster than both the gt/ gtp. and ve clubbie /gts .
i do not believe the ve ls2 is miles ahaed of the boss 290. maybe a tad. but not a mile . and the f6 is in a differant league . no matter what the mags say about the ls2 versus the f6/gt. the only way i can speak with a little knowledge behingd me is because i've seen the times at the drags . and i've seen them on youtube. what the owners say always defends thier own choice . so i tend not to take that as gospel. if you wanna get real technical .i havent seen an f6 match any xr6t at the drags yet . so whats that telling you about the f6. is it just a wormed xr6t.
there you go. your typhoon adds at least 1 inch to your small mate , happy now .

Blonk · 25-10-2007, 12:00 PM

gtfpv... I agree entirely with your post, but the 5.4, is no match for the 6.0 from my experience, I have 2 mates (1 of which is a memebr here) that went from XR6T straight to GT and had a blower on them under 4000km's..... I respect there opinions becasue they own them and they agree that once they can go over 300rw's with a deecent tune, they have aq much more drivable car then the I6T.

The boss is no match for the 6.0 litre.. Tuna has already pulled 270rw with just a tune... A boss mtor needs a lot of work or incution to get those numbers..\

GT ownersw will think the mag is biased, I think they are spot on... And I have a blue wardrobe and blue blood

3vXT · 25-10-2007, 12:13 PM

Nice work with the mum reference, i agree with you about the boss.
6T> LS2> Boss, IMO.

I always liked motor better than wheels and i don't think its biased. I haven't bought enough wheels mags to be able to comment about them.

5.4 GT · 25-10-2007, 12:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ADSF6

Only a few months ago Motor or wheels tested manual GTS307 and manual BF Typhoon. Both punched out mid 5's and high 13's. GTS stopping the clock quicker and Typhoon have a larger terminal speed. And in gear acceleration the Typhoon creamed it!

Its been argued many time before, but I have owned both, BA GTP and now BF Typhoon, and however sounding the worse, the Typhoon is miles quicker.

I have no problems with the BF F6s... its the BaMkIIs that are living off the BFs success that I have a problem with. The times recorded in any mag for the BaMkIIs have been miles off that of the BFs (the BFs being alot faster in any comparison). I have no idea why it's so, but it just is, the BFs are alot faster and the BaMkIIs seem like nothing to crow about except for their exploding clutches!!

gtfpv · 25-10-2007, 12:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blonk

gtfpv... I agree entirely with your post, but the 5.4, is no match for the 6.0 from my experience, I have 2 mates (1 of which is a memebr here) that went from XR6T straight to GT and had a blower on them under 4000km's..... I respect there opinions becasue they own them and they agree that once they can go over 300rw's with a deecent tune, they have aq much more drivable car then the I6T.

The boss is no match for the 6.0 litre.. Tuna has already pulled 270rw with just a tune... A boss mtor needs a lot of work or incution to get those numbers..\

GT ownersw will think the mag is biased, I think they are spot on... And I have a blue wardrobe and blue blood

well . i cant literally comment on the ls2. but have seen low 14's at the track. not quite low 13's like the wheels mags promote. i have seen both xr8's gt's xr6 t's all in high 13's to low 14's and f6's doing high 12's to mid 13's . so i cant conclude that the ls2 is such a great leap and bound ahead ( like the mags say.)
my gt made 264 RWKW. on a dyno . with no tune just a cai , and catback.
but i dont want to get into a kw versus performance argument here as they dont seem to co incide. i'd have to assume that my GT WOULD do a mid 13 to low 14 sec 400m time , like the rest of em . which is what i see out of the ls2 v8.
however . if drivers believe there is a differance due to actuall experiance than i am happy to hear . i just havent experianced or seen it yet .

gtfpv · 25-10-2007, 12:31 PM

cant wait till 'orion is . released . imagine the bragging rights between f6 and gt then .
of course wheels will probably make slower times than the VE GTS at the track . lets wait and see.

Disciple · 25-10-2007, 01:07 PM

Slightly OT, but what is the rough 1/4 mile time for a BA MKII XR6T 4 speed auto? (stock)

Blonk · 25-10-2007, 03:53 PM