Enough is enough........No more BULL!

[RGB]

Hi all,

Firstly a sincere thank you, I've never been much of a forum poster, I'm deeply indebted to all those who don't share my affliction and readily pass on their knowledge and experiences. I've owned Aussie Fords from XL onwards, always reliable, simple and inexpensive to maintain, even the supposedly dodgy models, there's still two left in the family. Hindsight says I probably should have kept a couple instead of upgrading, two in particular, XA 2v 351 Fairmont with factory GT suspension/wheels , XE police interceptor, good cars in their day.

The following incident happened to my son and his girlfriend recently, car is a twin turbo Nissan, booked in for rear shock replacement only, they decided to do a wheel alignment as well, forgot to tighten the lock nuts on the adjustable front camber link, car lasted about four hours before suspension collapsed, thankfully at walking pace.
I accept mistakes happen, even really bad ones, I was just grateful at the time nothing really disastrous happened, especially considering they'd almost completed a quick round trip Melbourne/Morwell in the rain.
What happened next is the really alarming part to this little story, the workshop's ridiculously incompetent attempt at repairs and their apparent inability to comprehend the dangers involved, just to save a few dollars.

What followed was two weeks of absolute BULL, both at workshop and management level, head office refusing to escalate beyond state manager level to alleviate stalemate.

The first picture shows the camber link, movement has allowed the threads to work against each other until its just let go.
First solution..........deny threads are stripped, well maybe just the first one or two, and wind adjuster in beyond damaged threads, stating car must have had previous damage that their unable to locate, ignoring the fact that they have apparently successfully conducted a wheel alignment that their now unable to confirm was completed because "it's been lost in the system".
No explanation as to how a car with such an absurd amount of negative camber has four tyres wearing evenly across the entire tread.

Second solution.........as shown in second picture, put washers between mounting bracket and chassis rail! No thanks!

It's been about a week now, they've made two attempts to hand back a car that's clearly not acceptable and probably downright dangerous, management are backing claims of previous damage and want to know why I'm keen to argue over a "****** little wheel alignment".

By now I've done some research and request camber arm be removed, which revealed an outstanding example of an expert technicians' professional workmanship to the mounting bracket!
I then measure length of camber arm on bench, 165mm. - stock is 178mm. No wonder the wheel is at such a stupid angle. Disassemble camber arm, sure enough, the threads are stripped, only engaged by a few inner threads beyond damaged area.
Next proposed solution..........re-cut damaged threads, Ah..... no thanks!

Management agree to install new camber arms, stating it's a goodwill gesture as the car has previous unidentifiable damage.......real professionals!
Repairs take another week, "we can't locate parts", refuse two requests to install standard components - "we're looking after you, just want you to be happy", then it's Express Post has not arrived, refuse to quote tracking number.........

BULL, BULL,BULL.

Eventually car is returned with wheel alignment print out, so far, so good.

My dilemma is, I'm feeling an increasing sense of responsibility to somehow cause some degree of accountability to be applied to these clowns before something really bad happens to someone less fortunate, however there's no registration/licencing authority to lodge a complaint with, seems they're able to stick a uniform on any moron and advertise him to be a highly trained expert technician. You never know, it may be you or someone you care about driving along the highway when some poor bugger coming in the opposite direction has his wheel fall off in front of you.

Am I being overly alarmist?

Your thoughts appreciated.

Cheers

[hammos57]

mate go and see a solictor and ask him what he thinks. in a small town then go to another town/city to see legal people(friends with management,related)Its amazing what a solictors letter to said party will do sometimes

[mik]

It would not be Impossible for parts to have damaged threads from someone's previous work,
im sure most of us over the years have pulled cars to bits only to find damaged threads, bits qnd peices ........... but if that was the case you would think he would have reported it and asked if he could replace buggered items, regardless, suspension should not collapse after coming out of the workshop.

[Tonz]

Ae you a member of your state motoring body.... NRMA RACQ etc if not well you should have been. They have legal eagles for this type of crapit would have cost a damn sight less than a solicitor will and thats the only way your going to get action.

[xisled]

If the car has been repaired and no one got hurt in the process, nothing further you can do.

Complain to head office is about all you going to be able to do.

A solictor can not do anything unless you want to sue them. But what are you going to sue them for, unless they are still refusing to repair teh car to the way it was before.

[RGB]

Hi,
Thanks for your responses, I probably need to better explain, it's finished for us, my main concern is that the next person may be less fortunate, they obviously don't care at all if after the event they were prepared to send an unsafe car back onto public roads. This is an organisation that spends a fortune advertising just how important well maintained suspension components are to ensure your safety, it's all a load of BULL.
The idiot that tried to orchestrate the bullshit repairs is out of his depth fixing a kids trike, should not be managing a workshop and influencing junior employees.
Someone will end up under a B Double or something,.

[Hally]

Ahh, its Pedders.

[Tonz]

what about using Facebook, businesses who are wary of their reputation are scared of facebook. Without good PR it can do a lot of damage plus its a good way to make others aware of what can possibly happen.

[Yellow_Festiva]

Originally Posted by Tonz

what about using Facebook, businesses who are wary of their reputation are scared of facebook. Without good PR it can do a lot of damage plus its a good way to make others aware of what can possibly happen.

If it is the abovementioned franchise then they are also a site sponsor...

[cobramania]

You could always goto the MTA (Motor Traders Association) in your state, they have a Code of Ethics/Conduct, for dealing with the public & quality of workmanship.

If the said company is a member of the MTA (which I think they are), the MTA would be interested in the operations of it's members. The MTA tries very hard to uphold the publics confidence in a members business operations, & them being allowed to use the MTA logo.

"Deal With Someone You Can Trust" is the MTA's moto.

I also think the Dept. of Fair Trading Act in NSW, has been amended to require repairers comply with the MTA Code of Conduct.

[OwnTheRoad]

Originally Posted by cobramania

You could always goto the MTA (Motor Traders Association) in your state, they have a Code of Ethics/Conduct, for dealing with the public & quality of workmanship.

If the said company is a member of the MTA (which I think they are), the MTA would be interested in the operations of it's members. The MTA tries very hard to uphold the publics confidence in a members business operations, & them being allowed to use the MTA logo.

"Deal With Someone You Can Trust" is the MTA's moto.

I also think the Dept. of Fair Trading Act in NSW, has been amended to require repairers comply with the MTA Code of Conduct.

I think it's the VACC in Victoria . Victorian Automobile Chamber of Commerce ?

[nickdl]

Originally Posted by FTEMEL

I think it's the VACC in Victoria . Victorian Automobile Chamber of Commerce ?

Correct. They'd be the best to talk to.

[pottery beige]

ive had the same sorta **** out of a Fraud dealer

[russellw]

Originally Posted by RGB

Hi,
Thanks for your responses, I probably need to better explain, it's finished for us, my main concern is that the next person may be less fortunate, they obviously don't care at all if after the event they were prepared to send an unsafe car back onto public roads. This is an organisation that spends a fortune advertising just how important well maintained suspension components are to ensure your safety, it's all a load of BULL.
The idiot that tried to orchestrate the bullshit repairs is out of his depth fixing a kids trike, should not be managing a workshop and influencing junior employees.
Someone will end up under a B Double or something,.

There is a much simpler way given that the business concerned is a site sponsor with two of their senior staff members heavily involved with AFF and that is to contact one of those people via the PM system.

I have found both of these people to be dedicated to ensuring their customers have a good experience and I am sure that any such approach will be dealt with appropriately.

As most of you are aware, the business operates via a mix of franchised and owned outlets and while it is difficult to maintain quality in the former (particularly in regards to personnel) there are also very clear expectations from the business about how those franchises conduct themselves.

Regards
Russ

[buggerlugs]

Originally Posted by russellw

There is a much simpler way given that the business concerned is a site sponsor with two of their senior staff members heavily involved with AFF and that is to contact one of those people via the PM system.

I have found both of these people to be dedicated to ensuring their customers have a good experience and I am sure that any such approach will be dealt with appropriately.

As most of you are aware, the business operates via a mix of franchised and owned outlets and while it is difficult to maintain quality in the former (particularly in regards to personnel) there are also very clear expectations from the business about how those franchises conduct themselves.

Regards
Russ

Agree completely. Having been involved with a franchise for ten years, if you can speak to the top people it will get sorted in house and believe me , it will get sorted.............

[XB GS 351 Coupe]

Used Pedders once years ago, had similar experience, in the end gave up and removed all Pedders parts from my vehicle and everything was fine.

[Spurious]

I have to question why the workshop performed a wheel alignment after fitting "rear" shocks. I've not had anything to do with Nissans (presumably Skyline), so do these need to have a rear wheel alignment after the stated replacement parts are fitted?

Was the customer notified that the alignment needed to be done?

Was there indeed previously undiagnosed issues with the suspension
& can the workshop verify this? Nissan Skylines would have to be one of the most modifiable cars on the market so who knows what a previous owner has done.
Did the labourers find the previous damage & fail to report it to the customer?
Some very serious question here that need to be answered.

I also believe it to be a fair statement that one workshop is not representative of ALL the brand named workshops.

[XC50077]

In NSW wheel alignment technicians have to be qualified. RUSSELLW's post is the best way to address this situation.
We all expect and deserve [and PAY for] that work on our cars is performed by professional's ,and particularly when it's steering, suspension or brakes.
I have had work on my xr8 by this organisation and am very happy with the service and quality of the workmanship.

[zilo]

Tell me which model Nissan it is, I have a couple of wrecks here on the farm.

(180sx and Silvia)


might get you out of trouble...?

[RGB]

Hi, Thanks for the input, food for thought.

To clarify a few points........
Don't believe they're members of the VACC, in any case it's a Business Association, it's primary focus is to promote/protect the interests of members, no clout, worst and possibly only sanction is disbarment, unlikely as then they can't collect fees.
I consider I gave the guy running the workshop more than a fair go, I contacted head office after a week of enduring BULL by the bucket load.
It's debatable whether a wheel alignment was necessary, as no components that have an effect are disturbed. The quote was to replace shocks only, on pick up it's changed to, standard procedure, we're looking after you, can't be too careful, car like that, Bull Bull Bull, blah blah, blah...........typical crap.
I suspect they've somehow released the car before completing the wheel alignment, that's the reason why the alignment report was never obtainable.

My initial conversation with the state manager was in relation to obtaining a print out of the wheel alignment report..........."no problem, every customer is entitled to that report, I'll organise it and call you back within the hour".
Thanks, that's great, now I have this other issue.........."oh ****, I'll find out what's going on and call you back.
Half a day later I get a call, only this time the attitude has completely changed to aggressive/defensive.
We agree they are to replace camber links and I must confirm in writing.

Below is my response, names deleted.

"Hello again xxx,
As confirmed during our telephone discussion earlier, I'm agreeable to xxxxxxx sourcing and installing aftermarket replacement adjustable FUCA links and any other components required to replace the damaged unit and restore the car to acceptable wheel alignment specification, provided all components are obtained from a reputable supplier and are fit for purpose.

Understandably, I now have no faith in the abilities of the staff at xxxxxxx and request that yourself or another senior person supervises all work undertaken on the vehicle.

While I understand mistakes can happen, even really bad ones and I agree xxxx now readily acknowledges a mistake has occurred in this instance, by far the worst aspect to this fiasco is the eagerness of xxxx to return the car to the road in an unsafe condition, particularly considering the outcome would almost certainly have been very different but for the wet roads and reduced cornering stresses on the day, the car was lucky to survive as long as it did. Given xxxxx inability to learn from mistakes one can only hope the next victims are as fortunate.

I appreciate you have a job to do and your immediate priority in dealing with me in this matter is to protect the interests of xxxxx, however now that you've been made aware of the competencies at the xxxxx location, I hope your alarm bells are ringing and action taken to prevent a repeat.

To date I have kept this matter low key and have been tolerant with xxxxx attempts at repairs, indicating I was content to give him time to affect repairs satisfactorily. I have telephoned the workshop once, (this morning just prior to contacting you). I have visited the workshop twice, on both occasions the vehicle was presented for collection in an unsafe condition. Any claims of harassment or inability to understand my preferred outcomes are a fabrication. Provided a satisfactory resolution can be achieved in an expedient time frame, I'm happy to let the issue rest and have no intentions of making further claims against xxxxx or expanding this matter beyond present participants.

I do not accept the premise that the fitment of an adjustable FUCA dictates the vehicle in question has problems, xxxxx sells a wide range of "performance" suspension accessories, I'm sure they’re not promoted exclusively to owners of faulty cars. My understanding is the xxxxx business strategy is to quote for rectification repairs when satisfactory wheel alignment outcomes cannot be achieved, no inadequacies were noted on the repair invoice.

I hope our concerns can be resolved amicably.

Regards"

It takes another week before the car is ready, usual excuses, BULL BULL BULL, despite me pointing them to second hand standard components and the easy availability of after market units as they're the same across several models.

It's a simple job, could have been finished in a few hours.

Reason for delay............State manager operates from the other side of town, he'll attend to this issue when it ties in with other priorities. Meanwhile, my son and his girlfriend are trying to commute, for two weeks, in one car, to two different work locations with differing start and finish times, from way out in the badlands, via the Monash car park,
4 1/2, 5 hours a day in total, and still sometimes late. Management was aware of this, of course their priorities were more important.

It has been suggested I make contact with management via this forum, to resolve this issue, I have to admit, I'm real retarded when it comes to computers and the 'net, I don't no how, so if some one can make them aware of this thread, that would be great , thank you. However I have to question, for what purpose, how can the issue be resolved, it's over for us, what's done is done, my concern is for each and every person that walks through their door in the future. What could they possibly to say to me, we're sorry , we'll amend our operating practices that have been so successful over the years; I don't think so! Expertly trained technicians; the guy in question must have wagged every class exept for the one on how to fend off customer complaints by applying copious amounts of BULL,their whole set up is geared to restrict communication for a reason.

I am confident management are aware of this issue, below is a quote from the state manager's email advising me the car was ready for collection.


"I’m pleased to see all is well, also camber readings are fantastic!
Again, we apologise for any inconvenience and thankfully the end result is great."

That's the only form of apology received, dumb as I am about emails etc, even I know the difference between cc and Bcc, the email was cc'd to four other company recipients, I have no idea what roles they have, they were however included for a reason, all were contacted, response.......none!

In summary if management wants to make contact, private or public, fair enough, I'm here put your case forward.

Cheers

[XB GS 351 Coupe]

May be 'all bull' could be a new slogan for this company.

Have dealt with a few outlets and all have been bad.

[jaydee]

Had a similar thing happen to me in Perth, No Bull, just picked it up from workshop, next day going thru a roundabout, steering collapsed, got away with it luckily as I was going slow. Had to tow it back, they fixed it but wouldn't pay for the tow.

[XW-BAXR6T]

Im staying clear of em, not taking chances. thanks for the heads up!

[BHDOGS]

Ah yes I got a wheel alignment done there aswell went back next week to get some
More work on rear live axle done they recommended a front wheel alignment I said you did one last week he said nothing on computer about it and shrugged his shoulders it had never been done in first place