is it worth supercharging a 6?

sfr rob · 26-02-2006, 03:57 PM

as the title reads... is it worth it or not?

would you see much power increase or woudl turboing be better?

Duffman · 26-02-2006, 04:14 PM

I know turbo is around the 10k mark while supercharing is around the 6k mark. I have no idea which one would be better but id prefer a turbo.

stiddy · 26-02-2006, 04:38 PM

I prefer supercharging over a turbo, probably make more power with a turbo, but it dosnet mean you'll go quicker..
Aslong as you stay away from Powerdyne superchargers you'll be fine.. depends on what you want really..

svo347 · 26-02-2006, 04:40 PM

My personal pref would be Turbo

Laminge · 26-02-2006, 04:41 PM

I had a powerdyne on my au2xr8

Basically bolt on, unichip (use an edit) bigger injectors, and your up an away.

Rollin · 26-02-2006, 05:05 PM

by their design V-motors lend themselves to supercharging.

turbos are easier to fit to Inline engines.

you would get more go putting a turbo on your car than a supercharger.

stockstandard · 26-02-2006, 05:19 PM

Its a lot easier to get a legal supercharger setup - just talk to capa.

Quote:

Originally Posted by stiddy

Aslong as you stay away from Powerdyne superchargers you'll be fine.. depends on what you want really..

Nothing wrong with a powerdyne unless you push them for big power.

stiddy · 26-02-2006, 05:33 PM

yeah thats why I said, depends on what you want.
for a basic setup powerdyne would be fine, but if you want something decent, decent being over 200rwkw.. i would say look at a Vortech S-trim..

T3man · 26-02-2006, 06:01 PM

Supercharging the Ford six is very worthwhile. You can achieve about 240kW with around 8psi. Turbocharging will of course do the same.

Supercharging and turbocharging deliver power in different ways. It depends what you're looking for in driveability. Basically with a supercharger the boost builds in a linear fashion according to engine revs and so the car will drive just the way it did before but have more power throughout the rev range. It will be noticeably faster to accellerate at higher revs - you won't get that "running out of puff" feeling as you approach higher revs - the power just keeps on building.

With a turbo you can achieve much higher boost at lower revs which totally transforms the way the car drives. When it hits boost you are thrown back in the seat and the accelleration is "animal". However it puts much more stress on your drivetrain.

Turbos can be more ecomomical because it is literally "boost on demand" - regardless of the engine speed if you don't "push" the accellerator you will get "normal" engine performance and therefore "normal" fuel usage. A supercharger is boosting all the time and therefore needs extra fuel all the time. If you are prepared to potter about at low revs the supercharger will only use about 10 - 15 % more fuel than normal.

The turbo will put a lot of extra heat under the bonnet so you will have to be prepared to lag everything nearby and put lots of heat shields about the engine bay. In my own turbo 4.1 I have constant fan forced ventillation drawing out air through the inner guard.

Whichever way you go you will be VERY happy with the result I can assure you - it's like suddenly having a 50% larger capacity engine and all the fun associated with it!

sfr rob · 26-02-2006, 08:08 PM

nice! thanks alot for the input guys.

I really dont want to go down the turbocharging road, it just seems to expensive and will most probably keep costing me with replacing parts that cant handle the abnormal power that is generated when the turbo hits.. hard.

I would rather have that power all through the rev range, rather than it coming in when it hits boost.

For 6 G's i reckon that is reasonable for a good setup that would be easy to pass all the RTA mumbo jumbo and an engineers' OK shouldnt be too hard to get, as apposed to a turbo setup.

Anyway, i will mill over this for a while, i still want to super charge my BA V8... that would be fun!

thanks
Rob

**Mechan1k** · 26-02-2006, 09:53 PM

I was looking at the supercharging option on LPG work work purposes.
I don't rev the guts out of the ute ... well somtimes I have to but prefer not to. Hence looking at supercharging .... also towing and heavy load driving I usually keep revs to a minimum ... i just want very low down torque ... nothing up-top.

It's a case of forking out the cash ... and the time that the vehicle needs to be off the road for install and tuning (I really can't have the ute off the road for more than 1 day due to work purposes).

But it all depends on what you want to do with it though.

My personal preference is supercharging though for the I6 auto ... if it was manual ... then yes I'd look at turbocharging.

sfr rob · 26-02-2006, 10:16 PM

hmm, i used to drive a 1 tonne ute a few years ago, and i know what you mean about not being able to have the vehicle off the road for more than a day without noticing a dent in the weeks pay!

supercharging would be ideal for heavy loads, but is it really worth spending 4-6 G's on more bottom end? i know you probably arnt going to anyway.

by the way.. do you have photos of your new kit yet?????

AnthonyQLD · 27-02-2006, 10:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sfr rob

i still want to super charge my BA V8... that would be fun!

:evilking: You know you want to

:

Sprint347 · 27-02-2006, 10:40 AM

with the amount of xr6-t's getting around these days i'd just wait another 12 months and snap a motor up when people start to make oopsies.

you'll probably get a motor with 50,000kms, garret turbo for the amount of money you'd spend now on a supercharger kit

my 2c

4.9 EF Futura · 27-02-2006, 10:51 AM

For starters you need to define what kind of supercharger. I assume you are talking centrigual as positive displacement is a whole new ball game. Centrifugal will not 'boost' all the time like positive displacement... Its boost is completely linear...

If we're talking centrifugal i'll make another assumption and say we're talking CAPA.

If you want easy, bolt on RWKW then this is the go. I had mine up and running in about a week and that included 40+hours of time in the office.

Turbo will most likely be quicker - but more expensive, time consuming and you'll have to do a LOT more reading.

And dont believe too much anti-hype about powerdyne units. Im at around 20,000km on mine - will let you know if i have any problems but almost 2 years now and hasnt missed a beat...

Walkinshaw · 27-02-2006, 11:19 AM

If you want to have some serious fun without the painfull lag of turbos (yes yes I know, your’s spools at 2300rpm with 5psi. Some of us want 15lb @ 900rpm), get yourself a real mans blower. Look at either an Eaton M112 with intergral bypass valve, or if you want to step right up look at getting your hands on an SRM, Whipple, Kenne Bell or Auto Rotor twin screw blower.

4.9 EF Futura · 27-02-2006, 11:20 AM

You're a sick man, dan. But yes... that would be unbelievable to drive!!!

stiddy · 27-02-2006, 12:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Walkinshaw

If you want to have some serious fun without the painfull lag of turbos (yes yes I know, your’s spools at 2300rpm with 5psi. Some of us want 15lb @ 900rpm), get yourself a real mans blower. Look at either an Eaton M112 with intergral bypass valve, or if you want to step right up look at getting your hands on an SRM, Whipple, Kenne Bell or Auto Rotor twin screw blower.

As nice as it sounds, can it be done to a i6, without $38106713 of custom work?
has anyone done it?

**Mechan1k** · 27-02-2006, 07:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sfr rob

hmm, i used to drive a 1 tonne ute a few years ago, and i know what you mean about not being able to have the vehicle off the road for more than a day without noticing a dent in the weeks pay!

supercharging would be ideal for heavy loads, but is it really worth spending 4-6 G's on more bottom end? i know you probably arnt going to anyway.

by the way.. do you have photos of your new kit yet?????

Kit goes on Mar 11 ... will have pics then.

Funny about this thread starting the other day ... I was at Cresent Motors today and was speaking to Joe about a few things (also picking up my new LPG diamond for my numberplates) ... and he asked me if i was still interested in the blower kit from Snort ... he had been speaking to them yesterday and was told that the low-PSI kit is just about ready (full kit that will bolt up without modifications at all .. drive-in drive-out ... ONE DAY).

I am now tempted again ... LOL

The kit is looking to be around the $4K mark installed ... maybe slightly less.

Will let you know when i get more info on this.

I am tempted to pay this amount for 500+Nm of rear wheel torque ... hell yes I am.

sfr rob · 27-02-2006, 08:03 PM

HELL yeah, that sounds interesting..

The thing is i have VERY limited knowledge about anyhting to do with turbo's or superchragers, hence my thread topic..

**Mechan1k** · 27-02-2006, 08:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sfr rob

HELL yeah, that sounds interesting..

The thing is i have VERY limited knowledge about anyhting to do with turbo's or superchragers, hence my thread topic..

Same here ... hence why i speak to someone who knows ... hee hee
I'll get more detailed information as it comes to hand about this kit.
It won't be on Snort's website yet ... but it's nearing completion for public purchase ... just a case of finalising the fitting so it's an easy bolt-up .. and final testing on a test vehicle.

sfr rob · 27-02-2006, 08:14 PM

and it is compatible with LPG yes?????????

**Mechan1k** · 27-02-2006, 08:22 PM

Yes indeedy ... just needs to change the way the converter works when it sees boost though ... that's the only thing that needs working on afterwards (Joe has fixed this before on a turbo LPG Falcon though ... so it's not a real issue).

Baboon_AU · 27-02-2006, 08:27 PM

superchargers and turbos but 60% more wear on your engine remember..

jonbays · 27-02-2006, 08:28 PM

I reckon the supercharger is easier to fit and get a engineers certificate for and thats a good start. Powerwise it's good maybe not as good as a turbo but close and a nice flat power curve with power everywhere which is good for street. You see powerdynes low prssure gear giving 160 odd rwkw and up to 180rwkw with pretty stock engines without any huge spend. If you want to rebuild the engine from scratch 240rwkw is possible but for that spend you could buy a S/H BA XR6T anyway!

Truth is saving your dough to buy an XR6T is the better option.

**Mechan1k** · 27-02-2006, 08:33 PM

I am after the low-boost option ... just for better low-down torque ... hence why I think S/C is better for that reason ... the kit I am after does not need a cooler either ... so no extra plumbing needed either.

Jonbays .. I was told about the 150rwkw mark for the EGAS engine ... but I am more interested in the torque figure though ... I don't want to rev the motor out anyway and I am not interested in racing either.

sfr rob · 27-02-2006, 09:14 PM

Jonbays... i here ya mate..
thats why i went and bought a V8.. hehehehe

stiddy · 27-02-2006, 11:21 PM

But not everyone wants to go and buy a BA XR6T as the alternative, actually getting sick of hearing it "why dont you just buy a XR6T" or "why dont you just buy a V8"

whats wrong with keeping and working with what you have?

I think an s/c I6 AU that you've built would be better than any BA XR6T, may not be as fast, but still it will be worth more to you, knowing that you built it, spent the time and money on it.. and it wont be just another generic car on the road.

and a 13second AU is more impressive then a 12second BA XR6T. A 13second AU takes ALOT more then a drive in drive out 12second off the shelf kit..

**Mechan1k** · 27-02-2006, 11:27 PM

I'd love an XR6T ... but they don't make them on LPG.
Actually there is no boosted LPG vehicle that Ford make.
For work I really do need to run an LPG vehicle ... otherwise it's not worth doing courier work on petrol.

I am trying to do mods that will benefit my work (and play as well) ... also if something does go bang ... AU motors are much cheaper to come by than BA engines.

stiddy · 27-02-2006, 11:35 PM

Im not knocking the BA's they are a fine car, but its just getting over the top with people saying if you want to go hard the only option is to get a XR6T..

Id say whack a blower onto an AU, and be happy.. and you will be..